Old Complete Monster cleanup thread
Welcome to the new Complete Monster (CM) cleanup thread! This thread is where we clean up or cut already-existing entries.
If you're looking to add new entries, please see the approval thread.
IMPORTANT: Before you begin any discussions on this thread, please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List. Here, you'll find explanations of the criteria for the trope as well as our rules/procedures for approving and cutting candidates.
What goes through this thread?
- Cut requests. If you believe a CM has been approved and they do not count, this thread is where you propose their removal. To know how to go about this, please see the FAQ folder on the Administrivia page, where the process is explained in detail.
- If we ever need to consider cutting multiple examples without individually reviewing them (e.g. if we discover widespread plagiarism with a particular troper's CMs), the initial discussion will be on this thread and we'll then escalate to the mod team (as described here) to get a formal consensus if we decide to recommend a mass cut.
- If an entry was put on the wrong subpage/YMMV page, you may propose where they should be moved to.
- Full rewrites of existing entries, including expansions, trims, and ground-up rewrites. If your rewrite is approved by the thread, feel free to add it to the drafts page so that other users can check grammar and the like before it is included with the rest of the weekly swaps.
- If an entry on a work's YMMV page doesn't match the entry on the media subpage, you can bring it here to discuss which entry works better.
What does not go through this thread?
- New candidate proposals - as stated before, those are done on this thread.
- Unapproved wicks - if a Troper encounters either of these kinds of wicks, they can be cut with no approval.
- Any CM link on a non-YMMV page - as a YMMV trope, it should not be linked on those pages regardless of any cleanup effort. The only exception is if the wick is being used within the definition of another trope.
- If an CM link on a YMMV page refers to an unapproved character. If it refers to an approved character on any such page, the wick can stay. On the other hand, if the unapproved character being linked to sounds like they might have promise (and you don't feel like checking it out for yourself), feel free to mention it on the approval thread - someone may already know why they don't count, or it could invite a brand new discussion!
- Proposals for images, quotes, and videos of already-approved CMs - quotes and images are proposed on the approval thread, while videos can be uploaded normally as they are screened for approval by the moderation.
- Crosswicking examples to YMMV pages - if an example has already been approved and added to the main page, you do not require any special permission to add the example to a work's YMMV page (assuming the work has a page already). If a YMMV page doesn't exist yet, then you can make it yourself, but either way, feel free to just add the example without asking.
- Small changes to existing entries - these can simply be done on a Troper's own prerogative with no approval.
- Spelling and grammar fixes.
- Pothole changes.
- Minor rewordings.
- Spoiler tags.
While these changes do not require any kind of approval, it is requested that should you make any of these changes, you do one of the following:
- Make the same changes on the relevant Sandbox page, then add the Sandbox to the list at the bottom of the drafts page. This will add the Sandbox to the weekly swaps and ensure that the edits end up on the relevant locked page. If the Sandbox is already listed, then once you make the edits, your job is already done!
- If you don't know how the Sandboxes work or simply don't have the time to find it, then you can simply post on the thread about the changes you made. Someone else can then make the edit on the relevant Sandbox and add it to the weekly swaps.
- Alternatively, you can simply request that the change be made directly to the locked page on the Locked Pages thread. Members of this thread keep track of that one, so we will ensure that the changes are made in the Sandbox so that it doesn't get deleted during the next swap.
Again, these changes don't require any approval, but we prefer to keep the entries on the YMMV pages and the locked pages the same in order to avoid any miscommunication or errors between entries, so if you do make the change, we would greatly appreciate it if you could ensure the change is made on the locked page as well.
As a final note, we do not care what other sites have to say regarding whether or not a character counts. We have our own criteria and they have theirs for their CM equivalents; while they are similar, they are not exactly the same and should not be treated as such. Another site removing a character from their equivalent should not be a reason why a cut is proposed here, and if this is the case, it will likely lead to mod intervention.
Other than this, once again, welcome to the cleanup thread, and we look forward to your contributions!
Edited by Mrph1 on Jan 14th 2024 at 11:30:03 AM
Jogo
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I'm fine with striking that bit between the parantheses
Edited by jlvs200s on Apr 28th 2024 at 9:55:38 PM
"Stand proud, Sukuna, you are strong." | He/Him
Pretty sure that bit was an unapproved addition, it's not in his entry on Video Games: Q to S
REALITY IS AN ILLUSION, THE UNIVERSE IS A HOLOGRAM, BUY GOLD BYEEEE! | She/Her
Simple enough then, cheers!
Pages giving the too-long warning:
Monster.Web Animation has a spoiler quote at the top. I've brought this up a couple times before, but the conversation stalled at finding a replacement quote. Even if a replacement is not found, the current quote will need to go. (Page quotes are optional; the spoiler policy is not.)
The Moron
Honestly, this is something I've meant to bring up before - I don't know if anything from the Chorus Trilogy needs to be spoiled anymore. Beyond the real world time, four seasons have passed since anything spoiler-worthy from either Malcolm Hargrove or Felix has happened, and stuff from seasons 14 and 17 actually relies on on the knowledge that Felix is up to no good. I honestly think we can remove the spoiler tags at YMMV.Red Vs Blue The Chorus Trilogy and keep Felix's quote on the main Web Animation page. Does anyone have any thoughts about that?
I’ll take a potato chip… and EAT IT!
This probably isn’t the right thread to answer that, but I don’t know where to take it.
In honor of Akira Toriyama
This is getting out of the scope of this thread (I wrote my previous post with the assumption the consensus about it being too spoilery still held), so moving to the Violations of the Spoiler Policy thread.
I found this in Fabian Cortez's page.
- Heel–Face Turn: At the end of Way of X, Nightcrawler, against all odds, manages to get through to and rehabilitate Fabian, making Fabian confront someone (Lost) who he has hurt, feel empathy, self-reflect, and bare his own soul, which causes Lost to let go of her hatred of him, depowering Onslaught. Fabian and Lost are last shown working together for the betterment of Krakoa.
Also on Way of X:
- Heel–Face Door-Slam: In issue #5, Kurt actually manages to get through to Fabian Cortez, and it seems like Cortez is set to turn over a new leaf. He later turns up in a catatonic state with Xavier deciding he's too much trouble to kill and resurrect.
- Heroic Sacrifice: In issue #5, Kurt makes one by teleporting the falling moon Phobos back into orbit. The effort costs his life.
Anyone familiar with the comics knowing whether or not this is legit?
Lies and Violence!
IIRC, I believe we're judging all the Krakoa stuff as Depending on the Writer, unless it's major retcons to origin stories like with Apocalypse. It's why Gorgon is still up even though he buries the hatchet with Wolverine—at least, that's how I think we're treating it.
Goku Black
You dont need to worry about that for Fabian. Even In-Universe people still hate the guy and think hes a prick. And as the resident Hate Sink of the x men rogues gallery its pretty likely he'll head back to being a dick after this arc . (Like id bet on it)
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Yeah him and selene
Edited by miraculous on Apr 29th 2024 at 12:48:23 PM
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
I think I remember it also being discussed that characters that also got similar redeeming traits like Omega Red also went back to being assholes as well.
Edited by TurlesTheVegan on Apr 29th 2024 at 3:29:39 PM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Yeah, they're probably fine for now, but worth keeping an eye on like we did Apocalypse.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
pronounced 'Scraggle'
Got a rewrite for one of my old candidates, Alduin from Skyrim, mostly to address issues of weird continuity and trimming some redundancy.
Old:
- Alduin is the World-Eater and the firstborn of Akatosh. Responsible for the corruption of the Leaper King into the Daedric Prince of Destruction, Mehrunes Dagon, Alduin ultimately decides to conquer Nirn instead of destroying it as he is meant to. Alduin erects a tyrannical reign among him and his dragon brethren, dividing up power among the Dragon Priests, human zealots who exercised wanton cruelty. After accidentally being cast forward into the fourth era by an Elder Scroll, Alduin, out of spite, decides to destroy Nirn before his allotted time, razing the town of Helgen and resurrecting other dragons to cause further havoc across Skyrim. After being defeated once by the Last Dragonborn, Alduin cowardly deserts the battle, fleeing into Sovngarde to consume the souls of fallen warriors to empower himself. Deliberately forsaking his divine duty as Eater of Worlds to instead indulge in his own limitless megalomania, Alduin is ultimately little more than an arrogant, cowardly sadist of a god in the skin of a jet-black dragon.
New:
- Alduin is the so-called Firstborn of Akatosh, the World-Eater responsible for devouring Nirn so that the next iteration of the world may take its place. A capricious sadist of a god who decided he'd prefer to rule the world instead of destroying it, Alduin took over Nirn and exercised widespread cruelty until he was banished into the Fourth Era by an Elder Scroll. Deciding then to destroy the world before his allotted time out of spite, Alduin razes the entire town of Helgen to the ground and kills nearly everyone there, and resurrects many of his fellow dragons to cause further havoc across Skyrim. Alduin later deserts a battle with the Last Dragonborn to instead eat the souls of the dead in Sovngarde for a cheap power boost, an act of cowardice that earns him nothing but disgust from his dragon brethren. According to the obscure text "The Eating-Birth of Dagon", Alduin may have even been responsible for the creation of Mehrunes Dagon, Daedric Prince of Destruction, indirectly putting all the carnage Dagon is responsible for—including the Oblivion Crisis—on Alduin's head.
Edited by Starkrafty on Apr 29th 2024 at 8:22:38 AM
Watch for the sign of the Saint — he will be back!
I like the rewrite of the incidental villain to Skyrim who exists while you have fun!
Just a starting content creator
I wouldn't include the part about Alduin being responsible for the Oblivion Crisis. It implies he planned it.
Check out my YouTube channel! I make audiobooks and whatever else I feel like!
pronounced 'Scraggle'
Also, I have a cut for us from Inhumanoids:
- Blackthorne Shore is a wealthy industrialist who came across the secrets of the Inhumanoids. Blackthorne attempts to free them to use them to take control of the world, allowing them to first wreak death and destruction at their whim. When his own sister Sandra is turned into an undead monster by D'Compose, Blackthorne acts horrified—but then abandons the heroes to die when they try to save her so he can take control of Metlar, settling for allying with him to present him with a way to destroy most of the world so Blackthorne can rule over the remainder. After being foiled, Blackthorne eventually starts a Cult with D'Compose, convincing numerous young men and women to submit themselves to the evil Inhumanoid to be changed into his undead slaves. Blackthorne continues to try to control the Inhumanoids and kill the heroes in his quest to dominate the world, fully admitting that he himself is an utterly evil, monstrous human being as wicked as any Inhumanoid.
Blackthorne has a case of Even Evil Has Loved Ones. The writeup claims he "acts" horrified but that's a flat lie—when Sandra is mutated by D'Compose, Blackthorne reacts in genuine horror, screaming "Sandra, I never meant...!"
The only weird thing, honestly, is that the quality is kind of inconsistent—a later episode has him try and down a plane that he knows has his sister on it, and he doesn't comment on it—but then an episode toward the end of the series has D'Compose mutate Sandra again, and Blackthorne's reaction is the same: pure horror and concern for his sister.
It's weird and inconsistent but the series ultimately seems to settle on him caring for his sister, even if they're opposing each other, so I'm saying "cut."
Watch for the sign of the Saint — he will be back!
Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object
Cut Blackthorne
IPP Wick Check created.
Cut Blackthorne. Also fine with the Alduin rewrite as it is.
Cut Blackthorne
REALITY IS AN ILLUSION, THE UNIVERSE IS A HOLOGRAM, BUY GOLD BYEEEE! | She/Her
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Cut Blackthorne.
Edited by Bullman on Apr 29th 2024 at 11:24:07 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Ultimate Moral Compass
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Alduin rewrite
Cut Blackthorne
"No running in the halls!"
Given Dissidia gives Emperor Palamecia and Kefka redeeming qualities, if it was proven to be canon, would we need to cut them from Monster.Final Fantasy?
Just a starting content creator
That's a massive "if". In any case, Dissidia has been well-established as taking place within a seperate universe with different versions of the characters.
Check out my YouTube channel! I make audiobooks and whatever else I feel like!
Not the Eye
Cut Blackthorne
Noticed on Red Dead:
It sounds like he's not aware the lands aren't actually "oil-rich" and his plot being All for Nothing shouldn't be attributed to him since obviously it's not a crime of his. We cool striking the bit in parentheses?