History Headscratchers / EscapeFromNewYork

** I read it less as him being pissed off because he wasn't going to tell Snake at all, and more pissed off because the doctor insisted on having the beans spilled before Hauk was ''ready'' to spill them. Telling Snake at that very minute wastes valuable time that Snake could be using to get in his glider, fly across the harbour, and rescue the president on Snake freaking out and threatening the doctor and such. I suspect Hauk was planning on telling Snake that little detail at a point when it would be far too late for him to turn back or do anything about it -- such as, say, over the radio when he was already flying over the harbour and not in a position to threaten Hauk or anyone else ("Oh, by the way, Snake, in case you had any cute ideas about turning that bird around towards Canada, something we forgot to tell you about those injections you had...").

** I read it less as him being pissed off because he wasn't going to tell Snake at all, and more pissed off because the doctor insisted on having the beans spilled before Hauk was ''ready'' to. Telling Snake at that very minute wastes valuable time that Snake could be using to get in his glider, fly across the harbour, and rescue the president on Snake freaking out and threatening the doctor and such. I suspect Hauk was planning on telling Snake that little detail at a point when it would be far too late for him to turn back or do anything about it -- such as, say, over the radio when he was already flying over the harbour and not in a position to threaten Hauk or anyone else ("Oh, by the way, Snake, in case you had any cute ideas about turning that bird around towards Canada, something we forgot to tell you about those injections you had...").

** I get the feeling from the rant that the female hijacker announces over the radio and the overall way that everyone else on the plane is acting that the hijacking was more of a murder-suicide mission than a kidnapping; "Let's make a statement by hijacking Air Force One and crashing it into the largest and most dangerous prison in the world, thus killing the President in the most prominent symbol of his oppressive neo-fascist government!" being the most likely form of logic used by the terrorists. Revealing what they're doing just before they crash allows them to make the statement whilst minimizing the opportunities for the authorities to somehow intervene and stop them. As for location, the plane probably wasn't supposed to be anywhere near the prison airspace, but the terrorists diverted it there.

** In addition to the above, it's part of the satire of the movies; Carpenter's using the sci-fi conceit of the films to in part make a comment on the world he was living in, which as others said was one where political corruption and extremism, increasing crime levels, urban gang warfare and ghettoization were major concerns, both in New York (the late seventies / early eighties) and Los Angeles (the nineties). The prison / sealed off from the mainland scenarios are conceits that enable Carpenter to show what happens when you turn these problems UpToEleven. Another reason is, essentially, RuleOfCool.

** No, it's just good old RuleOfDrama: there's no story if everyone's dead because the United States and the Soviet Union nuked each other into cinders. The fact that the US and the USSR are having some kind of military clashes with each other is intended to suggest that the setting of the story is [=FUBAR=] and dystopian and overall Not At All Good, and there are a few hints here and there that the world might actually be heading towards nuclear armageddon, but considering it the future of an alternative history is, well, over-thinking it a little bit. The viewer is free to WMG such a situation if they really want to, but ultimately the history and worldbuilding isn't really the point, it's really just there to support the premise by allowing the viewer to picture the kind of world where turning Manhattan into a giant free-range prison is actually a half-decent idea.

** Sort of a SocietyMarchesOn: Manhattan was a crime-ridden hellhole and rapidly falling into complete anarchy at the time the movie was released, as were the other boroughs. Everyone who could afford to had moved out into suburbs. It was entirely plausible to audiences of the day that things really could get this bad (also see ''Film/TheWarriors''), and the idea that ten years later New York would completely turn around and retake the title of a financial and cultural center of the world was fairly preposterous to most.

** New York in 1981 was MUCH different than the city we know today. Movies like DeathWish and Film/TheWarriors were disturbingly accurate in showing life in the city at the time. Almost anyone with money had fled to the suburbs. Infrastructure was completely decayed, crime and vandalism were everywhere. The city had declared bankruptcy in the late 70’s and the federal government had refused to bail the city out causing then Mayor Ed Koch to declare “America has given up on New York.” So while the premise is far-fetched. It wasn’t inconceivable that the entire city would eventually be abandoned.

** New York in 1981 was MUCH different than the city we know today. Movies like DeathWish and TheWarriors were disturbingly accurate in showing life in the city at the time. Almost anyone with money had fled to the suburbs. Infrastructure was completely decayed, crime and vandalism were everywhere. The city had declared bankruptcy in the late 70’s and the federal government had refused to bail the city out causing then Mayor Ed Koch to declare “America has given up on New York.” So while the premise is far-fetched. It wasn’t inconceivable that the entire city would eventually be abandoned.

* First off, why the hell would air force 1 fly over the most dangerous maximum security prison in the world? Second, if these hijackers were smart, they wouldn't of just revealed what the hell they were doing over the mainland, they would do it over the sea.
** Well, as Air Force One was ''hijacked'', we can assume that it wasn't ''supposed'' to fly over Manhattan but the hijackers diverted it there once they'd gained control. Witness how shocked Hauk et al are that Air Force One is in their airspace.

*** For the sequel, California suffers "The Big One", an earthquake so vicious that it effectively turns California into a new island, and everybody is left for dead. Also remember that in this new reality, USA is no longer the most powerful nation of the world, and the whole planet is depicted as a chaotic place to live in anyways; there are no help funds, the UN either doesn't exist or its just another bureaucratic figurehead with little power and influence; why would the US bother to save California in the first place?

** The ''ComicBook/EscapeFromNewYork'' comic series delves a bit more into this -- the world is on a slow slope into the gutter, with society, infrastructure and basic services sliding backwards into a NewOldWest vibe. Several cities are either shown to be destroyed/separated from the U.S. (Pennsylvania is suggested as having been destroyed, via the ShoutOut opening image representing its place in the "snake" logo, much of downtown Cleveland is destroyed during the final arc, Florida is outright separated from the country by nuclear detonations), and Snake visits several areas that are either completely devoid of people or resemble a Western town. If the situation is so bad that entire parts of the country are functionally unusable, it isn't a stretch to think that a single city (even a big one) could be walled off and used as a maximum-security prison.

** Premarital sex isn't illegal UNTIL Escape From LA as clearly shown in that film (the plethora of moral laws weren't put in place until the US became basically a theocracy under the new President). To answer your question, yes, boatloads of teens get arrested and deported as you can see in the beginning of Escape From LA.

*** No, it didn't. It is pretty obvious the tape held plans for a new power source. It is stated in the movie that the tape contains the secrets to nuclear fusion, the summit it is being shown at is a peace summit to end the war, and the ones at the summit are the biggest enemies of the US (enemies that that have killed millions of it's people). Why would the President share the plans for a new bomb to his country's biggest enemies (let alone do so at a PEACE summit), and how exactly could he hope to use said plans to control the rest of the world after handing them over to said enemies?

** Thing is, even if we allow all those things... a couple of minutes and some genuine, heartfelt thanks to the people who literally saved his life aren't that much to ask at all. In fact, they're the bare minimum of someone who has literally just had his life saved. Snake isn't asking him to burst into tears or rend his garments or cancel the summit just to pour his heart out, he's just looking for a minute's honesty, some heartfelt compassion to the fallen, genuine appreciation of those who gave everything for his life, an indication that his experiences genuinely have affected him in some way. Heck, even some signs that he's traumatised would be a sign that what he's been through has affected him in some way. In short, some signs that underneath all the politics this guy actually is a sincere, genuine human being. And he doesn't get it. All he gets is some bullshit politico talk, vague non-promises, and a brush-off. Traumatised or not, as far as Snake is concerned, the guy's just an empty phony.

*** Or opting to being electrocuted on the premises if you don't want to be shipped to the prison.

** Also, ''Film/EscapeFromLA'' *doesn't* happen a few years later. It's more of a remake. The two stories don't co-incide in the same timeline, they're alternate versions of each other.
*** For the sequel, California suffers "The Big One", an earthquake so vicious that it effectively turns California into a new island, and everybody is left for dead. Also remember that in this new reality, USA is no longer the most powerful nation of the world, and the whole planet is depicted as a chaotic place to live in anyways; there are no help funds, the UN either doesnt exist or its just another bureaucratic figurehead with little power and influence; why would the US bother to save California in the first place?

** The President didnt exist in a vacuum, the world is in the state it is because of the collective effort/apathy of everyone living in it. It's pointed out more specifically in the sequel when Snake more or less just states that the world isnt worth saving because humanity has had ample opportunity to pull back from the brink yet just kept doing the same shit. Dystopian regimes dont just rely on the leader, there's literally thousands of people who could have blown his brains out at any time, but didnt lift a finger to stop him.

** I agree, total dick move. Hell, I don't even think the President was as much of a jerk as everyone keeps saying. So just because he didn't go all Shatner-level {{Wangst}} that means he didn't give a shit?

** The film makes it clear that the infrastructure in New York is rotting, to put it mildly. What we see of the World Trade Center shows that it has been repeatedly defaced and ripped apart, so such an extent that it doesn't look habitable. The only reason why no one went up on the roof is because it wasn't originally accessible. Had Carpenter's plans for a certain sequence in ''Film/EscapeFromLA'' come to fruition, more individuals living in high-rise buildings, including a homeless family eating dinner in a skyscraper and a woman dancing on top of one of the buildings, would have been shown.

** Also, if there was an emergency (such as a particularly massive uprising) that was threatening to spill over to the mainland and the United States Police Force needed to get into the island ''en mass'' to deal with it quickly, then it'd be easier and quicker to ferry a large force across the bridges and through the tunnels than just relying solely on an air or naval assault. They'd know where the mines were so that wouldn't be as much of a problem and could push the ruined cars aside with tanks and heavy vehicles, but if they'd blown the bridges / tunnels they wouldn't be able to get in.